Vanilla WoW - VanillaGaming

General Category => Server Changelogs => Topic started by: Ergamemnon on November 12, 2016, 05:25:11 pm



Title: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ergamemnon on November 12, 2016, 05:25:11 pm
There are also some older fixes (that might already be live) listed, that weren't listed in past changelogs yet


(http://logon.vanillagaming.org/img/pending.png)



*Naxxramas:
- fixed Plaguewoods trash agroing through walls during Noth fight
- Z fixed the timer on re-marking at 4HM

*Scholomance:
- fixed lootchances for old treasure chest

*Items:
- Thunderfury procrange got fine tuned again

*Misc:
- Eranikus, Tyrant of the Dream will now automatically spawn in the middle of Nighthaven, as soon as the correlating quest is started


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on November 15, 2016, 12:35:33 pm
Can anyone confirm the 4HM timers got indeed fixed or did I misunderstood and it's not supposed to be live yet ?


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Alda on November 15, 2016, 03:01:27 pm
*Misc:
- Eranikus, Tyrant of the Dream will now automatically spawn in the middle of Nighthaven, as soon as the correlating quest is started

Will keeper Rumelos also move there or whats up with that?


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on November 15, 2016, 03:47:42 pm
I abandoned the quest and took it again from Remulos, he didn't move and I didn't see Eranikus but maybe I didn't check that well.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on November 23, 2016, 01:06:42 pm
When will those changes be effective ?


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Atreyyo on November 23, 2016, 02:06:28 pm
There are also some older fixes (that might already be live) listed, that weren't listed in past changelogs yet


(http://logon.vanillagaming.org/img/pending.png)



*Naxxramas:
- Z fixed the timer on re-marking at 4HM

Will you also fix 4HM hp?



Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Gnoem on November 27, 2016, 11:16:13 am
There are also some older fixes (that might already be live) listed, that weren't listed in past changelogs yet


(http://logon.vanillagaming.org/img/pending.png)



*Naxxramas:
- Z fixed the timer on re-marking at 4HM

Will you also fix 4HM hp?



Whats the point? Its gonna be as easy as it was as long as healers and tanks follow their rotation. Previously it was a faceroll, no challenge at all -.-

And im really hoping for a feenix like Kel'thuzad with 9 million HP so it remains unkilled for atleast a year


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Atreyyo on November 27, 2016, 10:51:17 pm
There are also some older fixes (that might already be live) listed, that weren't listed in past changelogs yet


(http://logon.vanillagaming.org/img/pending.png)



*Naxxramas:
- Z fixed the timer on re-marking at 4HM

Will you also fix 4HM hp?



Whats the point? Its gonna be as easy as it was as long as healers and tanks follow their rotation. Previously it was a faceroll, no challenge at all -.-

And im really hoping for a feenix like Kel'thuzad with 9 million HP so it remains unkilled for atleast a year

You whine on and on about things not being blizzlike and yet here you come with this bullshit about "Whats the point?".

Intentionally leaving unblizzlike scripted boss encounters kinda goes against what they are trying to do here.

Just because people have played this game for over 10 years and perfected their gameplay does not mean that you have to make these fights harder, if it's not what the server admins want, a plain "funserver" where they can tweak anything to whatever they want.



Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: wopwop on November 28, 2016, 07:54:27 am
Just because people have played this game for over 10 years and perfected their gameplay does not mean that you have to make these fights harder, if it's not what the server admins want, a plain "funserver" where they can tweak anything to whatever they want.

The players on this server have always been carried by something. From the start it was stacking pots/hots, missing boss mechanics, wrong scaling, 1.12 talents and gear. Today ~99% of the mechanics are there, the hot/pot stacking is fixed and the talents/spells are up to date with 1.12 but the gear acquired during those times are still here and carries us . Sadly no one got to experience the naxx as it was supposed to be. Take patchwerk for an example, or even better 4hm.

Overtuning the 2 last bosses in this expansion by increasing their HP to compensate for the extreme gear advantage we have compared to the guilds clearing them in vanilla is something I think the devs should consider. Make the 2 last kills actually mean something, challenge the players as blizzard once did in retial!


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Gnoem on November 28, 2016, 04:06:14 pm
Janitor said it all. I don't understand how youre not sick of farming same content over and over again with it not being a challenge at all. If Saph and KT are released with retail damage and HP values they will die within a week and thats just bullshit.. Rather make it close to unkillable so its a challenge for a few weeks atleast.
HP boost is a must considering broken ignite mechanics, amount of consumables available aswell as amount of saved world buffs, broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs and not to mention most of the guilda having FULL BiS geared players which is a huge difference compared to retail.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Atreyyo on November 28, 2016, 05:02:37 pm
Just because people have played this game for over 10 years and perfected their gameplay does not mean that you have to make these fights harder, if it's not what the server admins want, a plain "funserver" where they can tweak anything to whatever they want.

The players on this server have always been carried by something. From the start it was stacking pots/hots, missing boss mechanics, wrong scaling, 1.12 talents and gear. Today ~99% of the mechanics are there, the hot/pot stacking is fixed and the talents/spells are up to date with 1.12 but the gear acquired during those times are still here and carries us . Sadly no one got to experience the naxx as it was supposed to be. Take patchwerk for an example, or even better 4hm.

Overtuning the 2 last bosses in this expansion by increasing their HP to compensate for the extreme gear advantage we have compared to the guilds clearing them in vanilla is something I think the devs should consider. Make the 2 last kills actually mean something, challenge the players as blizzard once did in retial!

Janitor said it all. I don't understand how youre not sick of farming same content over and over again with it not being a challenge at all. If Saph and KT are released with retail damage and HP values they will die within a week and thats just bullshit.. Rather make it close to unkillable so its a challenge for a few weeks atleast.
HP boost is a must considering broken ignite mechanics, amount of consumables available aswell as amount of saved world buffs, broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs and not to mention most of the guilda having FULL BiS geared players which is a huge difference compared to retail.

Still VG lacks Dire Maul buffs (that 15%  hp increase)


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Poodlesnack on November 28, 2016, 06:21:33 pm
The only warlock coefficients that are off to my knowledge is Life Tap - and that's lower than the intended value.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on November 28, 2016, 08:13:19 pm
If Saph and KT are released with retail damage and HP values they will die within a week and thats just bullshit.. Rather make it close to unkillable so its a challenge for a few weeks atleast.

I wonder if it wwas your guild that could kill it the first week you would still say it's bullshit. Pretty sure the experts over at DP will make the struggle last several months, so you guys will have lots of time to complain about not having pally buffs.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: lsajt on November 28, 2016, 11:43:55 pm
Janitor said it all. I don't understand how youre not sick of farming same content over and over again with it not being a challenge at all. If Saph and KT are released with retail damage and HP values they will die within a week and thats just bullshit.. Rather make it close to unkillable so its a challenge for a few weeks atleast.
HP boost is a must considering broken ignite mechanics, amount of consumables available aswell as amount of saved world buffs, broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs and not to mention most of the guilda having FULL BiS geared players which is a huge difference compared to retail.

Idk if you have that amount of time to spend on games, but most of us enjoy the blizzlike challenge; overgeared or not; 2-3 times a week. Either you strive towards blizzlike or you dont. Broken mechanics or overtuned / undertuned shit is not something the dev's of VG strive for I'd assume, so it makes no sense to compensate for that with funserverlike HP values or w/e you want to add.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Gnoem on November 29, 2016, 09:27:04 am
Janitor said it all. I don't understand how youre not sick of farming same content over and over again with it not being a challenge at all. If Saph and KT are released with retail damage and HP values they will die within a week and thats just bullshit.. Rather make it close to unkillable so its a challenge for a few weeks atleast.
HP boost is a must considering broken ignite mechanics, amount of consumables available aswell as amount of saved world buffs, broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs and not to mention most of the guilda having FULL BiS geared players which is a huge difference compared to retail.

Idk if you have that amount of time to spend on games, but most of us enjoy the blizzlike challenge; overgeared or not; 2-3 times a week. Either you strive towards blizzlike or you dont. Broken mechanics or overtuned / undertuned shit is not something the dev's of VG strive for I'd assume, so it makes no sense to compensate for that with funserverlike HP values or w/e you want to add.

No i don't have time to be hardcore but still having full retail blizzlike FWL will kill the server earlier than it will die with it being close to unkillable.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on November 29, 2016, 10:37:25 am
damn ittt gnoem u know i <3 u, but idk wtf u just tried to say there


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Nimo on November 29, 2016, 02:22:34 pm
hes trying to say that once KT and Saph are roflstomped, and dont fool yourself, that they will be if ''blizzlike'' upon release, people just might stop playing cus clearing whole content and not even having the satisfaction or thrill of progressing through it like they are supposed to (without 8/9 full bis and other shit already mentioned in this post).
Im playing on a different server atm and recently had a chance to battle Kalecgos with 300% scaling. The funniest two nights of wiping in last 3 years with bis guild who farmed t6 for the past year. Not trying to advertise or anything and feel free to del this part of my message but just saying...


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Poodlesnack on November 29, 2016, 07:54:17 pm
... broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs ...
Is Judgement of the Crusader (http://db.vanillagaming.org/?spell=20308) used at all in raids?
And what warlock coefficients are broken, other than Life Tap?


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: imajeep on November 29, 2016, 09:06:13 pm
... broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs ...
Is Judgement of the Crusader (http://db.vanillagaming.org/?spell=20308) used at all in raids?
rofl


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Gnoem on November 29, 2016, 10:50:44 pm
... broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p), warlock spell coefs ...
Is Judgement of the Crusader (http://db.vanillagaming.org/?spell=20308) used at all in raids?
And what warlock coefficients are broken, other than Life Tap?

Death coil still does too much damage, unless it's been fixed while im absent. Also i was talking about Crusader enchant, but nice troll try


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: sveznajucastena on December 02, 2016, 10:26:16 am
broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p)

(http://i.imgur.com/GY9v3xG.png)

nothing wrong here mkay


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Atreyyo on December 02, 2016, 10:37:28 am
broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p)

(http://i.imgur.com/GY9v3xG.png)

nothing wrong here mkay

Go ahead and show those 15 windfury hits in a row aswell.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on December 02, 2016, 12:49:23 pm
broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p)

(http://i.imgur.com/GY9v3xG.png)

nothing wrong here mkay

oh  i get it now, gnoem is saying that there are several huge bugs with melee classes that almost all try hard melee players abuse, like the fact that you can have more than 2 stacks of crusader up at once if you deliberately use weapon swap macros to abuse that bug (by the way, plz ban that cvez fgt for posting proof that he abuses this bug), or the fact that hit scopes effect melee hits and lets melee use unblizzlike gear sets to do more dps cuz they dont have to sacrifice as much dps to stack hit, and that because gnoem and other melee scumbags like him cant be trusted to not abuse these bugs, EVERYONE WHO PLAYS A CASTER, HEALER, OR TANK SHOULD BE PUNISHED BY GIVING RAID BOSSES UNBLIZZLIKE HP.

what a great idea, iiii think it's almosst as good as the idea to give all bosses an unblizzlike resistance level to force casters to use spell pen gear instead of being able to use the blizzlike gear builds they should have used, all because 'RAID DPS IS TOO HIGH' and devs cba to fix all the obvious bugs with melee, so they have to nerf caster dps instead #vglogic

4srs tho gnoem, u dont even play here atm, what the fuck makes u think u have any right to give input that might effect the actual playerbase? didnt u and half ur guild already quit the server once u plebs finally managed to drag urselves thru the available content? and now ur back making demands to devs that they better script things the way u want or u will leave even sooner than before u were planning to?

I dddont think it's an exxageration to say that over 50% of the players on VG havent even killed Cthun yet, andd less than 15% of the playerbase clears naxx regularly. But all those people deserve the chance to sturggle through all that content in as close to blizzlike circumstances as devs can script, and then fight  sapph and kt under similar circumstances. Things shouldntt b made harder just because a very small fraction of the playerbase will be able to kill it after spending months/years loyally playing on this server in order to perfect their gear sets.  Idk how it works in serbia, but in murica we believe that loyalty should always be rewarded, not punished.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: eGene on December 02, 2016, 04:44:14 pm
I must say, that the release of 4HM was kind of disappointing for me, that we cleared it first night and been doing ever since. BUT, looking at how much other guilds have been struggling with 4HM, it seems like it was tuned pretty good.

I personally dont think Sapphiron will be much of a challenge for top guilds on the server, and I actually hope(just like Gnoem) that KT will be really hard and will require some nights or even weeks to kill for even top guilds.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: sveznajucastena on December 02, 2016, 05:38:58 pm
... like the fact that you can have more than 2 stacks of crusader up at once if you deliberately use weapon swap macros to abuse that bug (by the way, plz ban that cvez fgt for posting proof that he abuses this bug)

Link me the bug report.

what a great idea, iiii think it's almosst as good as the idea to give all bosses an unblizzlike resistance level to force casters to use spell pen gear instead of being able to use the blizzlike gear builds they should have used, all because 'RAID DPS IS TOO HIGH' and devs cba to fix all the obvious bugs with melee, so they have to nerf caster dps instead #vglogic

IIRC, melees were "nerfed" way long before casters, with proper armor stats on NPCs inside AQ40 and Naxx. They introduced spell penetration mainly because 40 debuff slots and consumable stacking, not the casters spell coefficients. Melees were also nerfed when the scaling on many different items was fixed (no more serbo rogues). But I agree that there is much more to be fixed, such as hit scope for melee, windfury/sword specialization procs, weapon swaping that doesn't trigger swing reset etc. Some of these things were proven and reported even, and yet there's still no fix.

I dddont think it's an exxageration to say that over 50% of the players on VG havent even killed Cthun yet, andd less than 15% of the playerbase clears naxx regularly.

Well it kinda is, because 3 or 4 of the top guilds clear AQ40.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: ohkillem on December 02, 2016, 05:40:34 pm
Make the 2 last kills actually mean something, challenge the players as blizzard once did in retial!


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Alda on December 02, 2016, 11:37:19 pm
I dont mind a challange untill some otehr guild can challange us. Might give em hope

But nonetheless, Gfk had a point right there. Gnoem go back yo your hole


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: MCB on December 03, 2016, 03:34:51 am
broken crusader proc(procs too much and u can have 3 buffs :p)

(http://i.imgur.com/GY9v3xG.png)

nothing wrong here mkay

oh  i get it now, gnoem is saying that there are several huge bugs with melee classes that almost all try hard melee players abuse, like the fact that you can have more than 2 stacks of crusader up at once if you deliberately use weapon swap macros to abuse that bug (by the way, plz ban that cvez fgt for posting proof that he abuses this bug), or the fact that hit scopes effect melee hits and lets melee use unblizzlike gear sets to do more dps cuz they dont have to sacrifice as much dps to stack hit, and that because gnoem and other melee scumbags like him cant be trusted to not abuse these bugs, EVERYONE WHO PLAYS A CASTER, HEALER, OR TANK SHOULD BE PUNISHED BY GIVING RAID BOSSES UNBLIZZLIKE HP.

what a great idea, iiii think it's almosst as good as the idea to give all bosses an unblizzlike resistance level to force casters to use spell pen gear instead of being able to use the blizzlike gear builds they should have used, all because 'RAID DPS IS TOO HIGH' and devs cba to fix all the obvious bugs with melee, so they have to nerf caster dps instead #vglogic

4srs tho gnoem, u dont even play here atm, what the fuck makes u think u have any right to give input that might effect the actual playerbase? didnt u and half ur guild already quit the server once u plebs finally managed to drag urselves thru the available content? and now ur back making demands to devs that they better script things the way u want or u will leave even sooner than before u were planning to?

I dddont think it's an exxageration to say that over 50% of the players on VG havent even killed Cthun yet, andd less than 15% of the playerbase clears naxx regularly. But all those people deserve the chance to sturggle through all that content in as close to blizzlike circumstances as devs can script, and then fight  sapph and kt under similar circumstances. Things shouldntt b made harder just because a very small fraction of the playerbase will be able to kill it after spending months/years loyally playing on this server in order to perfect their gear sets.  Idk how it works in serbia, but in murica we believe that loyalty should always be rewarded, not punished.

(https://media.giphy.com/media/AT6LbRAazEoPm/giphy.gif)


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: baddestbad on December 03, 2016, 03:37:55 am
(http://i.imgur.com/GY9v3xG.png)

nothing wrong here mkay
Working as intended...
Seems the melee community is over 2 years (iirc) behind me on this server... i had 3x crusader back in the days of 2 naxx wings bros :P


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: MCB on December 03, 2016, 04:24:12 am
Wow deeps you are just the best player ever.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: wopwop on December 03, 2016, 09:14:32 am
Seems the melee community is over 2 years (iirc) behind me on this server...
The fun part is that you actually believe that.   :-*

Idk how it works in serbia, but in murica we believe that loyalty should always be rewarded, not punished.
Not that I'm trying to defend serbja or anything but how is increasing KT's HP, making him somewhat a "blizzlike" encounter for those that are past anub/faerlina/raz (i.e all the "loyal" guilds that are carried by gear) a punishment for the loyal players?
But I see your point herro member, would be a shame if new guilds reached up to KT without having oldies and cant kill him due to extra HP. Think the last time we saw a guild without oldies reaching past anub/faerlina/raz was 2,5 years ago when MCST got Gluth (and thaddius?) down (with pot stacking and 40 debuffs ?).

Releasing KT with blizzlike values is a mistake. The player base will soon decrease and new guilds will struggle when the top guilds starts to recruit their good players. We won't see a new guild (without oldies) reaching KT _ever_




Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: TheNuld on December 03, 2016, 09:27:56 am
Lol pve


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Poodlesnack on December 03, 2016, 11:57:00 am
Quote from: VG's website frontpage
[...] to be completely blizzlike with no expections is a driving philosophy for all of our devs and staff members...
Quote from: VG's website frontpage
Vanillagaming is the first option for the players seeking truly challenging and blizzlike Naxxramas.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Samthebst/Samthepro on December 03, 2016, 12:04:09 pm
Seems the melee community is over 2 years (iirc) behind me on this server...
The fun part is that you actually believe that.   :-*

Idk how it works in serbia, but in murica we believe that loyalty should always be rewarded, not punished.
Not that I'm trying to defend serbja or anything but how is increasing KT's HP, making him somewhat a "blizzlike" encounter for those that are past anub/faerlina/raz (i.e all the "loyal" guilds that are carried by gear) a punishment for the loyal players?
But I see your point herro member, would be a shame if new guilds reached up to KT without having oldies and cant kill him due to extra HP. Think the last time we saw a guild without oldies reaching past anub/faerlina/raz was 2,5 years ago when MCST got Gluth (and thaddius?) down (with pot stacking and 40 debuffs ?).

Releasing KT with blizzlike values is a mistake. The player base will soon decrease and new guilds will struggle when the top guilds starts to recruit their good players. We won't see a new guild (without oldies) reaching KT _ever_



I bet every guild with proper attendance and gear level(Aka AQ40+BWL) can clear almost all bosses in Naxx..And reason why no new guild isnt progressing Naxx is plain and simple Fix buggy bosses in Naxx and you will see progression.
No point to make funserver


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on December 03, 2016, 01:36:59 pm
Think the last time we saw a guild without oldies reaching past anub/faerlina/raz was 2,5 years ago when MCST got Gluth (and thaddius?) down (with pot stacking and 40 debuffs ?).

Chaos says hello ^_^


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Strawie on December 03, 2016, 01:38:54 pm
Paradox says hello from the dead too.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on December 03, 2016, 03:45:41 pm
To get back on topic, both sides have valid arguments, but in my opinion it comes down to what you define as blizzlike. Obviously it can be as simple as "being exactly the way it was 10 years ago" but we know that it's not the case at the moment due to how things are.

Back then, when the top guilds were progressing new content, if we fix some arbitrary values and say their DPS, due to game mechanics and their gear, was 1 and that the new bosses' HP was 1 too, then it doesn't make sense to put the same HP values here, because clearly the top guilds DPS' on VG isn't 1 due to game mechanics and gear.

If you keep the same HP values as retail, that makes the new encounters sensibly much easier, and you can argue that it's not very blizzlike to have easy new encounters, when it is supposed to be hard and challenging.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on December 06, 2016, 10:09:21 am
Think the last time we saw a guild without oldies reaching past anub/faerlina/raz was 2,5 years ago when MCST got Gluth (and thaddius?) down (with pot stacking and 40 debuffs ?).

Chaos says hello ^_^

yea sarek is such a new player lol, as are the numerous players that left dp when he got kicked.
but im pretty sure even mcst had a couple oldies in thier ranks.

IIRC, melees were "nerfed" way long before casters, with proper armor stats on NPCs inside AQ40 and Naxx. They introduced spell penetration mainly because 40 debuff slots and consumable stacking, not the casters spell coefficients. Melees were also nerfed when the scaling on many different items was fixed (no more serbo rogues). But I agree that there is much more to be fixed, such as hit scope for melee, windfury/sword specialization procs, weapon swaping that doesn't trigger swing reset etc. Some of these things were proven and reported even, and yet there's still no fix.

man idk if u rele know what nerrfed means tbh. when something isnt wworking rite and gets scripted to blizzlike values itsss not a nerf, its a fix.

making items that werent supposed to stack with spell power not stack with spell power, and fixing cons effecting melee trinkets/weapons, so that they work in a more blizzlkike manner is nnot a nerf, it's a fix. adding correct armor valuesss iss not a nerf, its a fix. adding unblizzlike spell resistances to alll bosses is  a fucking nerf, not a fix.


Link me the bug report.
oh man i gotta remeber this for future use.
Well it kinda is, because 3 or 4 of the top guilds clear AQ40.
i think thaat u r over estimatimating the ratio of srs raiders vs casual scrubsss on tis server. i kno usss hardoccore peep ss like to post on the forums aaand be heros or whatever, but the majority of players dont even bother with forums add dont do raids past mc/aq20/zg pugs.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: lsajt on December 08, 2016, 03:10:11 am
Quote
nailed it. ppl got shit on while doing 4 horsemen, sapphiron and KT.
if u keep it the way blizzard released shit its no way near blizzlike comparing to their item level back then.
double the HP and we g00chie.

While this is true, as you probably realize they got shit on for not being bis geared up to the point of their own progress. Part of blizzlike is being able to clear stuff easier due to gear; which alot of guilds had time to do pre BC release; wether you like it or not. If you want harder encounters perhaps you should reroll and do naxxramas last wing in aq40 gear.

hugs'n'kisses


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on December 08, 2016, 09:45:59 am
tbh i just wanna know why only kt and sapph should have higher hp. By gnoem (and everyone who agrees with him)'s serb logic, shouldn't all naxx bosses have higher hp? and why not make it so all bosses have higher xp while ur at it? after all, the server is so old, no one could possibly struggle through a 5 man rite?

no one told people not to play here for the 5-6 years vg has been open, and no one told devs to release naxx piece by piece over 3-4 years. devs shouldnt deliberately make bosses unblizzlike just because people have been loyally playing on this server for years on end.

imo if u have been playing here for years on end and somehow don't have near bis and enough people willing to play with you who also have near bis, u shouldnt try to influence devs to punish those of us who do.

essentially wat im tryna say is: go fuck urself u dp fgts, no one cares wat u think about anything


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Atreyyo on December 08, 2016, 10:26:41 am
I don't know about the rest of the community, but I have high hopes for this final release of the classic world of warcraft.

I really hope the last content won't be released until properly tested to ensure the true blizzlike experience which vanillagaming is aiming for.

With that I'm talking about all boss/mob abilities/stats working as intended as mob ai, spells and environment.

If everything is working as intended, the last fights will be hard enough.

Really looking forward to it.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on December 08, 2016, 04:30:00 pm
Gfk, that wasn't entirely the point tho.
The point is to make it feel more blizzlike upon release. That comes back to the point I made about how one understands and feels what "blizzlike" should be.

I wasn't playing when the first three wings were released, so I cannot judge of their relative difficulty compared to the gear level when it was released.

I was playing when DK wing got released. Without saying it was easy, it can be argued it wasn't as difficult as when it was released on retail. Razuvious was relatively easy on retail and so it was here. Hardest part of Gothik was the coordination and I would say it's fairly transcribed on VG.

Now 4HM was clearly, clearly easier here and that's mainly due to the marks' re-apply timers being incorrect. Without saying I wished that it took as long to kill them as it took on retail (~80 days IIRC ?), GGC killed them super quickly, I don't remember about EQ but I believed it wasn't that long after GGC and DP killed them fairly quickly too. Chaos was still progressing Naxx, but once we had access to 4HM, it didn't take us that long either.

So, "tbh i just wanna know why only kt and sapph should have higher hp", the answer is to make it harder to make it feel more blizzlike, in the sense that it is supposed to be challenging and not be on insta-farm. You're free to agree with it or not, but that was what was meant.

I don't totally understand your point about loyalty and punishing. I wouldn't take it as a slap on the face if they made the final and new bosses harder and not insta-farmable. I would cherish the challenge and that would push my motivation ; but how you feel about it is personal and not totally relevant.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Poodlesnack on December 08, 2016, 05:24:16 pm
You can't discuss the subject without defining the term "Blizzlike". For some people it probably means "as close to the retail version of Classic WoW" and for some it might mean "an experience as close to the retail version of Classic WoW". The result will be different based on how you interpret the term.
With that said it is the owner and developer's interpretation that should be used. And with their focus on authentic sources and transparency I reckon they chose the first mentioned interpretation.
But perhaps they will listen to suggestions if they are brought forward in a civilized manner. If you insult and complain on the opposing party hard enough, VG-style.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: lsajt on December 08, 2016, 05:24:49 pm
but how you feel about it is personal and not totally relevant.

Altho it's relevant in the sence that opinions need to be put out here to make sure a few forumoldies wont push dev's into making funserver encounters. Also it's kinda fun how you want to make it blizzlike in the feeling, how would do you script feelings?


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on December 08, 2016, 10:33:22 pm
Now 4HM was clearly, clearly easier here and that's mainly due to the marks' re-apply timers being incorrect. Without saying I wished that it took as long to kill them as it took on retail (~80 days IIRC ?), GGC killed them super quickly, I don't remember about EQ but I believed it wasn't that long after GGC and DP killed them fairly quickly too. Chaos was still progressing Naxx, but once we had access to 4HM, it didn't take us that long either.
tbh the reason GG and EQ cleared 4HM so quickly was because we spent a week or two testing dk wing before release and even with the absolute bis gear GMs gave us to test out the wing (even including sapph/kt loot and a couple atieshes) we still wiped a lot of times before we managed to learn the encounters.
Vanilla is not hard, people said it was because they were young children with bad gaming skills and things like moving out of aoe, or having any sort of situational awareness was extremely uncommon, but anyone who doesnt suck at the game, and has 30-39 friends who also don't suck can power through any content. That's why GG got server first Plague Wing kills when half our raid was in blues, even though Unique, DP, EQ, and Paradox had all been in Naxx for a while before our guild even formed, and outgeared us by alot.

So, "tbh i just wanna know why only kt and sapph should have higher hp", the answer is to make it harder to make it feel more blizzlike, in the sense that it is supposed to be challenging and not be on insta-farm. You're free to agree with it or not, but that was what was meant.

I don't totally understand your point about loyalty and punishing. I wouldn't take it as a slap on the face if they made the final and new bosses harder and not insta-farmable. I wouldcherish the challenge and that would push my motivation ; but how you feel about it is personal and not totally relevant.
So your entire argument is based on how you personally feel, but my argument is irrelevant because you think it's based on my feelings. (even though my argument is that devs should script things as blizzlike as they can, because that's what they promised to do)
But I get it, only your personal feelings are relevant right?


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: wopwop on December 08, 2016, 11:34:22 pm
KT with blizzlike HP will not give the players a blizzlike feeling, I hope everyone can understand that. It's like doing an Ironman but having 1 week of rest in between each event.
Some want the blizzlike HP, some want the blizzlike challenge.


tbh i just wanna know why only kt and sapph should have higher hp. By gnoem (and everyone who agrees with him)'s serb logic, shouldn't all naxx bosses have higher hp? and why not make it so all bosses have higher xp while ur at it? after all, the server is so old, no one could possibly struggle through a 5 man rite?

Spot on, makes soo much sense ::)

tbh the reason GG and EQ cleared 4HM so quickly was because we spent a week or two testing dk wing before release and even with the absolute bis gear GMs gave us to test out the wing (even including sapph/kt loot and a couple atieshes) we still wiped a lot of times before we managed to learn the encounters.
Vanilla is not hard
Yet you haven't encountered a single boss as it was meant to be.

but anyone who doesnt suck at the game, and has 30-39 friends who also don't suck can power through any content. That's why GG got server first Plague Wing kills when half our raid was in blues, even though Unique, DP, EQ, and Paradox had all been in Naxx for a while before our guild even formed, and outgeared us by alot.
GG had more gear than world first guild and you still had the 40 debuff slot. But true some other guilds on VG had more/equal gear. 50% in blue is just BS tho.



Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Ayag on December 09, 2016, 01:26:17 am
Gfk, the first part of your post is true and make sense. That's also part of why I hope we (the community, or a part of it) wont be able to test the wing, so there is more to discover and more challenge.

I'm not that sold on "everyone back then sucked" as I do think that there was competent people in the top guilds and that gear made a huge part of progression and gearing up was slow as fuck. So here, us being able to farm content for aeons makes the "new" encounters easier, on top of the fact that the strategy are well well known.
Then we get back on "what do you think is blizzlike" (cf. Poodle's post).

Regarding the second part, I didn't say my feelings were relevant either. I just expressed them. I actually quite enjoy the discussion on how everyone think what is blizzlike (if you sort out the trashtalk) ; ultimately I don't think any of this will impact the devs. There is no need to make me appear egocentrical, that was not my intention ; I apologize if you felt that way.

PS : Jani check your PM.


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: MCB on December 09, 2016, 04:10:26 am
I want to get involved in this thread but there are just way too many words flying around. Let's try making our points in 50 words or less. Alternatively, memes can make points in few if any words.

(http://lybio.net/wp-content/uploads/Vicente-Fox-Im-Not-Going-To-Pay-For-That-Wall.jpg)
of text


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: wopwop on December 10, 2016, 09:13:10 am
Yet you haven't encountered a single boss as it was meant to be.
hey man i did stuff in retail vanilla cuz my bf was in a good guild and i got to get carried thru alott of studfff, but i didbnnt get too do dk winnng or frossst wyrn mm lair cuz zzz they needed for srs raiders fooor that stuff
Yet you haven't encountered a single boss as it was meant to be.
:-*

Anyways, some want blizzlike stats and some want blizzlike challange. You can't get both due to the unblizzlike release of naxx etc and it's pretty clear we PVE for different reasons. Guess it's up to zeard to decide what's best for the sever both now and in the future.



I really hope the last content won't be released until properly tested to ensure the true blizzlike experience which vanillagaming is aiming for.

With that I'm talking about all boss/mob abilities/stats working as intended as mob ai, spells and environment.
Well we are kinda screwd on that, Sapphiron's blizzard (as many other spells in the game) should be a binary spell. On VG there's no such thing as binary/non binary and I doubt anyone(me included) want to spend hrs making a legit report, since it would be move to the "bug tracker". And we all know that nothing comes back once it entered the land of bug tracker. 
However fixing this would make Sapphiron easier since people would be able to resist the slow effect the blizzard does so I'm fine with that  ;D Would be an awesome fix for pvp though.

Ps, if there is someone out there with access to the bug tracker please bump the ignite(!), the poison/enchant proc, swapping MH/OH without getting a swing-reset on both weps



Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: kaylolz on December 10, 2016, 09:26:35 am

ok so ima rekt jani and that ayag guy with my repliiiies soon but i just wanna caps lock a valid point for a bit first:

IF YOU FEEL LIKEEEK U R 2 GEARED TO STRUGGGLE ON FROSTWYRM LAIR THEN USE WORSE GEAR AND MAYBE ASK UR GUILD MATES TO USE WORSE GEAR SO THAT U CAN STRUGGGLE MORE ON FROSTWYM LAIR (ASSUMING THEY DIOONT GKICK U FOR BEING AAAAN IDIOT AND A FGT) U GOT LIEK 2 MONTHS UUNTIL FRPOOST WYRMM LAIR IS RELEASED, GO FARM SOME T1/T2 AND ASK UR GUILDIES TO DO THE SAME SO U CAN HAVE A SUPER BLIZZLIKE FROSTWYRM LAIR EXP. DONT TRY TO FORCE UR GAY AS FUCK EXPECTATIONS ON OTHER PLAYERS JUST CUZ UR GAY AND FROM SERBIA IMO.

for reals tho, y dont u dumb serb fgts jus ttt use worse gear if u wanna strugggle more than u alreay will, and let people who have spent years farming their gear use their gear on a blizzlike hp frost wyrm lair instead ooof trying to force an unblizzlike boss encounter on the entire server just cuz u personally feel like a regular fite wont be enough of a challenge for u?

increasing the hp of those bosses isnt even a fair way to balance the fight. they r already super long fights so mana wil be an issue for me/healers and i dont appreciate all u dumb fgt inaactive jerks trying to influence devs into making the fight more mana intensive by increasing the hp, (which by th ee way would just be another thing in the long list of terrible ideas that devs have im[plemented that totally fucked over casters and left melees almost unchanged.

if any of u dumb serb fgts wanna give sapph and kt llllike 40000000 milion armor and dodge chance i would b supportive tho


Title: Re: 2016-11-12(2)
Post by: Cohle on December 12, 2016, 01:16:48 pm

if u keep it the way blizzard released shit its no way near blizzlike comparing to their item level back then.
double the HP and we g00chie.


Forty keks.  I don't think i could've summed up VG and its thought process in a better sentence.